No Satan, No Hell, No Original Sin, No Vicarious Redemption; 2000 Years of Anti Judaism


I’ve been researching Judaic beliefs looking for answers to the relationship between two thousand years of antisemitism and how Christianity is taught and practiced. It now seems conclusive that Christianity is a religion that tenuously links the two religions, and is intentionally offensive to Judaic principles and philosophy. In fact Judaism as practiced and taught from the Tanahk undermines, and delegitimizes the Christian religion in essential contradictions that is not a natural prelude to it. 

The Jews do not believe in Original Sin, or in the ability of another person to pay for another persons sins. The central theme of Jesus is a belief that he suffered his crucifixion in order to pay for the sins of all mankind including original sin. 

Judaic theology believes that sin is a personal consequence of failing to live observing the Torah. The only way to correct for this failing is to apologize to God and to change the behavior. In Judaism sin is not an abstraction, or a commodity to be shared by descendants as it is in Christianity, instead sin is not extendable beyond the individual to the group.

So in Judaism Jesus could not have been a sin sacrifice for all mankind. This idea is offensive to Jews.

In Judaism there is only one God and man cannot be God. In Christianity, with the Trinity, polytheism is introduced as well as a pagan like man-God.

In Judaism there is no Hell, no Afterlife, and no Heaven. In Judaism Satan is not a noun but a verb meaning “a hindrance”. In Christianity Satan is Gods rival who in opposition to absolute good is absolute evil, and is a personage. 

In Judaism Heaven is on earth in life while in Christianity Heaven is a sterile concept as a place of purposelessness utterly devoid of anything interresting and is the place souls go for accepting Jesus as their savior. 

Savior in Judaism is used in reference to political or physical harm while in Christianity it’s an intangible term referring to resume from sin as a general commodity.

In Judaism the Afterlife is the idea that you live on in the memory of your friends and family. In Christianity the Afterlife is immortality of something nonphysical that survives the body. But Christians never say where their immortal soul was before they were born, so it had a beginning. So the word Eternal is misapplied because it would have always been and will be forever to be eternal. Jews believe only God is eternal(no beginning and no ending).

The differences just go on, and on, and on to the point that you begin to see that it is impossible for Christianity to have grown out of Judaism. In fact Judaism discredits Christianity on so many fundamental levels that the only thing left for Christians to do is to demonize, persecute, and abuse the religion, or to abandon their own religion as phony.

Jews know how to read and they are the experts on reading Hebrew. They know what their texts teach and that Christianity is not in any way compatible with it. And yet Christians are demanding that they recant, instead of just leaving them in peace it’s always been an immoral war against them. The love of Jesus my ass!

Jesus isn't God, but instead a commodity used by Christians like the concept of original sin, hereditary sin and abstract sin. It's befitting that they are representing him as a commercial character because it parallels corporate, insane Christianity. If you don't like the truth then go to Hell, a place that didn't exist in the texts until the Christian gospels.
Jesus isn’t God, but instead a commodity used by Christians like the concept of original sin, hereditary sin and abstract sin. It’s befitting that they are representing him as a commercial character because it parallels corporate, insane Christianity. If you don’t like the truth then go to Hell, a place that didn’t exist in the texts until the Christian gospels.

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91 thoughts

  1. Thank you for writing your blog, and I am intrigued with your statement: “Jews do not believe in Hell, Satan or the Afterlife.” In studying Jewish history, I found that the Sadducees did not believe in heaven, angels, hell, et. al., but that the Pharisees did believe in all of it. Is it true that currently all Jews believe as the Sadducees did?

  2. There is no reference to Satan(as a noun), Hell or an Afterlife in the Torah or Talmud, and so Jews at the time of Christ did not believe in them.
    After Christianity was established the Jews struggled with these ideas because of Christian pressure and still today struggle to find a reason to believe in an afterlife. Some reluctantly concede that you have an afterlife by living in the memories of your family and friends you leave behind.
    It is understood that this undermines Christianity and so Jews have been demonized for 2000 years.

  3. I appreciate your post and thoughts. I would like to clarify that not all Christian’s hold the view you presented. Myself, and many other Christians I know, do not hold the negative view of Judaism and the Jewish people discussed here. Biblically speaking, the Jewish people are God’s first chosen people and the foundation of all of Jesus’ teachings are based upon this fact and the true intent behind and fulfillment of the Law and covenants made in the Bible. I’d love to see a future post here that presents this perspective.

  4. The whole point is that Judaism conflicts with Christianity because in it there is no Heaven, Hell, Satan or Afterlife! Given that Christianity believes in these ideas and the Jews do not means that Judaism is in fundamental conflict with Christianity. This is significant because Christianity emerged from Judaism and the two are in fundamental opposition on the nature of god! Christianity is not an independent, stand alone religion!
    And so the historical dehumanizations of Jews is the result of this conflict. I am not talking about the implied goodness of Christians because this is a myth. I am talking about the evil done throughout history resulting from contradictory stories!

  5. You are right that there have been innumerable acts of hatred and violence in the name of Christianity. Along with similar atrocities done in the name of many belief systems. And, yes, there is a huge fundamental difference between the two. And, there are similarities. What the human race does with what God teaches does not change His fundamental identity and message. The enemy has made an art of using illusion to distort truth. Sweeping generalities about either view only serve to increase this.

    It sounds as if you have been savagely hurt. For this, I am truly saddened. I pray that you are given a wave of peace and healing.

  6. The fact that you think you speak for god means conflict. And this post was not about other belief systems but about Christian denialism and aggression! When you lecture people claiming the authority of god over them then you are creating hate and conflict so that hiding behind your religion is meaningless.

  7. Christianity is not compatible with Judaism for obvious reasons and so they have historically been adversaries. The blood of millions of Jews is on the hands of so called Christians and you are no better, I can tell by your comment!

  8. To who, your imaginary little friend? Are you catholic and talk to statues?
    Do you believe in Santa also?
    The fact is you can’t wrap your brain around the truth and so you have moved on to grasp at straws! Pffft! 🤪

  9. A concise histrocal Viwe. The seven universal commandments are the link, between Judaic and Christains. The Universal Commandments were taught snd well extablished within tne known world up until the destruction of tne secound temple of Solomon Temple. With The Roman invasion after the Uprising of Jerusalem.
    Like this post

  10. Then you should read them and pray for yourself! It’s all got nothing to do with this post, so take it somewhere else!

  11. Hell & Afterlife:
    Daniel 12:2 (CSB)
    2 Many who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake, some to eternal life, and some to disgrace and eternal contempt.

    Reference to a resurrection, and “disgrace and eternal contempt” certainly seem to be a pointer to “hell”.

    Afterlife/Resurrection:
    Job 19:26–27 (CSB)
    26 Even after my skin has been destroyed, yet I will see God in my flesh. 27 I will see him myself; my eyes will look at him, and not as a stranger. My heart longs within me.

    Isaiah 26:19 (CSB)
    19 Your dead will live; their bodies will rise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in the dust! For you will be covered with the morning dew, and the earth will bring out the departed spirits.

    Satan:
    Job 1-2 – Satan is mentioned several times, starting in Job 1:6.

    Zechariah 3:1–2 (CSB)
    1 Then he showed me the high priest Joshua standing before the angel of the LORD, with Satan standing at his right side to accuse him. 2 The LORD said to Satan: “The LORD rebuke you, Satan! May the LORD who has chosen Jerusalem rebuke you! Isn’t this man a burning stick snatched from the fire?”

    1 Chronicles 21:1 (CSB)
    1 Satan rose up against Israel and incited David to count the people of Israel.

  12. The word satan as used in the Hebrew Scriptures is not a noun, it’s a verb and so if you talk to a real Jewish scholar he will tell you he does not believe in the Christian character of Satan(with a capital “S”). This is yet another intentional falsification of the original texts done by those who invented Jesus.

  13. I won’t claim to know the Hebrew language, nor be especially insightful to the beliefs of the Jews at the ktime of Christ and prior concerning whether they believed in capital-S satan or not. It does seem odd that 2 of the 3 “satan” verses supplied have a definitive article prior, the 3rd does not… so would seem to me that either there is “the” accuser and/or the 3rd is a proper name. But I’m happy to move on from it, because I’m not convinced the significance you place upon a Jewish belief in there being a capital-S satan is warranted.
    Further, of the three things you mentioned that “Jews don’t believe in”: Hell, afterlife, and Satan… the only one you take issue with the provided scripture on is apparently Satan. So it would seem that’s all you are truly concerned about: Jews not believing in capital-S satan. And that, I believe, certainly does not warrant the conclusions you come to.
    Finally, won’t even approach the gross misrepresentation of the Christian faith.
    I have enjoyed the bit of research and thought though, so I do thank you.

  14. Christianity is not a continuation of Judaic beliefs as it pretends. In fact organized Christians have demonized Jews blaming calling them evil because of this. How are the facts a gross misrepresentation when Christians are just as nuts and evil as Wahhabi Islam? Who’s fault is it that those who invented Christianity had an anti Semitic and pro Roman agenda?

  15. The notion of Satan, used within NT writings, develops from the cultural understanding that existed in Jewish thought of the time. It is true that later developments move dramatically away from these cultural understandings but that is not the same as implying that Christians invented the concept. It is perhaps better to say that the Church lost its understanding of how the notion of Satan was being used. This can be seen in the book of Revelation (clearly written by a Jewish-Christian thinker). For John of Patmos, Satan (the Great Dragon) is not a supernatural being. It is the first earthly enemy of the Church (and no, that wasn’t Rome).

  16. So Satan does not exist in the Jewish tradition as an ego. And Hell does not exist at all in the Jewish tradition and so there is no need for an evil throne in hell for Satan as is the Christian story.
    Either Christianity has to be in agreement with the Jewish tradition or admit it has nothing truly in common with this tradition. So if the Jews are right about their own religion then Christianity is a lie!

  17. A small point, but in fact Hebrew Scripture does make use of “the satan” or “a satan” – that is, “the adversary” or “an adversary” – that is as a noun.

    As the gentleman in the second video notes, the *first* occurrence of the relevant term is as a verb. But there are a number of other occurrences as a nominative.

    This is, of course, not the same thing as saying that the adversary or adversaries referred to in Hebrew Scripture expresses the same idea expressed by “Satan” in Christian Scripture.

  18. Of course you’re right that there is and has been anti-semitism. If anything it’s on the rise today. But I’m not convinced it’s due to Christian doctrinal differences with Judaism. And, unlike you apparently, I haven’t experienced Christian churches trying to emphasize the continuity between Judaism and their beliefs, with the possible exception of Messianic Jewish or Hebrew Roots groups. If anything, in my experience, churches try to distance themselves are far as possible from adherence to or advocacy for “the Law”.

    But the far larger problem here is that the term “Christian” has been diluted, care of the modern institutionalized church, to the point that it is at best meaningless, and at worst the source of compelling indictments against “Christianity” as observers of the behavior of self-professed “Christians” conlcude: “If that’s the way you people operate, I don’t want any”. Anyone can label themselves a christian. Very, very few actually are; that is, fully repentent, dependent followers of Christ. And none of those are anti-semitic.

  19. The problem isn’t ” you people”, it’s the Christian Church that has doctrines that completely oppose Judaic beliefs and so Judaism has always been a threat to Christianity and because of this Christians have been mistreating the Jews for 2000 years.
    And it makes no difference that the churches do not as openly advocate hostility as much as they used to, the damage has been achieved and has momentum.
    Jews do not believe in Satan, Hell, Afterlife, Jesus, that man could be god(this is ridiculous to them), human blood sacrifice, original sin, blood sacrifice not compliant with the Talmud(in a temple etc..not in an open field), that one person can pay for the sins of another.
    If you are really interested in the truth look at jewsforjudaism.ca, watch the videos and learn! Christianity is a poorly constructed, tenuous, pagan adaptation of Judaism and cannot have flowed from Judeism organically.
    I certainly can’t help you to see the truth any more than if you help yourself that Christianity is based on fraud and rather than admit this has always needed to destroy the Jews to hide this secret.

  20. QUESTION? My two cents worth.. Why focus on Christianity? This is the first notion I have of the Jewish staunch stand against Christianity. Why not against the Muslims? For goodness sake! This is PREPOSTEROUS! Ridiculous.laughable in the sight of the Almighty Creator of everything in existence including us and Satan. Psalms 2. Not Christianity–all religions devised by the human mind. The fact? Our human mind’s imaginary conceptions of everything under the sun IS what it is. No regrets. No longer accusations of any kind. For.of sinners? I am chief but for the Almighty’s grace and love for me and for you.

    Yes! Satan is under the Almighty’s control and authority. Regardless! Despite it all? Despite all our ridiculous miss-conceptions about it all? O thank goodness! The Almighty Creator’s passionate love for His creation, for His world? Shall now be evident to ALL nations, to all people. Isaiah 48 and many other passages in the Torah and even in the newer Scriptures.

    Now? That’s all brand new to me. Never before have I seen or understood one iota of it all until now. Now, at the very last day of 2018. Anew. Fresh start? That’s our 2019 year for us all. Magical is the word! Much love, thiaBasilia. 🙂

    BTW? Your like? On time. All nations. all humans, this time? We all see and understand. 🙂

  21. The Christians are the intolerant ones, not the Muslims. Why would a discussion on Christian fraud and intolerance towards Jews include Islam, unless you want to introduce a distraction that’s irrelevant?
    If you want to know the truth Jews for Judaism has a large library of Rabbinical lectures explaining how Christianity is not based on Judaic principles and is a fake religion because it is dependent on but not consistent with it.
    jewsforjudaism.ca

  22. Not intended to open up a debate or discussion. I merely expressed my own ignorance along with every human being so far.
    Connection or not? Misunderstood or not? The Almighty is in control of it all. No problem. No need for human knowledge of any kind. It’s all vanity a striving after the wind and a feeding on it. Much love, thiaBasilia. 🙂

  23. You may not understand the Antisemitism from Christians but the Christian leadership is and has always known and so has encouraged the persecution. The Judeic religion proves Christianity is fake and has no concept of the Judaic God….in fact Judaism is strictly monotheistic and Christianity is polytheistic…this is not acceptable to the Torrah. Sunday is the Pagan Roman day of worship to the Roman Sungod cult of Mithras, so Christians are not worshipping YHWH but the pagan Roman God. The Catholic Church are idolterers, which is the Roman Pagan tradition of worshipping and praying to statues. I can’t go through it all for you.
    And Jews should have the right(they came first) to worship according to their texts, but this has infuriated Christianity that forces it’s garbage down everyone’s throat mindlessly!

  24. Absolutely right! And you do not the half of the corruption. SO WHAT? NO RELIGION IS EXEMPT FROM CORRUPTION. BELIEVE ME I HAVE EXPERIENCED THEM ALL. GO TO TEL AVIV AND VISIT WITH THE HOMOSEXUAL JEWS.
    LET THE ALMIGHTY PLUCK YOU OUT OF ANY RELIGION YOU ARE ENTRAPPED IN LIKE HE DID TO ME!
    No apology for speaking the truth loudly. I practice love not my hateful views and opinions about corruption or SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS. BEEN THERE DONE THAT! END OF DISCUSSION. Glad for the opportunity to speak up!

    Still much much much intense love for you for all Jews-Christians Muslims Atheists and what have you in this insanity ridden world for now that we inhabit.
    Soon we will all see the light from the darkness of our human minds! 🙂

  25. Christianity is just a big big lie, so don’t worry about anyone else and clean your own backyard!

  26. Well? Are you cleaning your own backyard? lol lol lol Truly? In the midst of this colossal mess that we have made of ourselves and of this loved world that we inhabit? In the midst or among it all? There is joy inexplicable with each sinner that like myself, is coming home where we belong–underneath His everlasting arms. Hahaha! HalleluYah!

    The Creator’s laughter is ringing! His child is coming home! Just woke up! My thinking? You and your comments. I thought I am going to blast him off his pedestal for good! But! My next thought, Father? Let me leg go of this upheaval in my soul that this child of Yours has caused me. Don’t let me get smug and join the crowd of sinners. You are in control of it all. I refuse to go or do ANYTHING as per my own ideas and thinking and feelings.

    With that? I came to the computer to check what’s happening in this maze called Internet. Ah! What now? Let see what’s his beef now? CLICK! WOW! He’s back for more? Click again. O my precious one, I don’t dare to call you brother because you might get offended if I do, but! You really are a precious one in the sight of the Almighty. That’s it. Got to get on with my own assigned task. No telling what am I to write next. We’ll see. Intense love for you and for all remains big time! thiaBasilia. 🙂

  27. Ordinarily I wouldn’t have responded. But your “Christianity is based on a fraud” statement changed that.

    You’re certainly right: Christianity isn’t an adaptation of Judaism. It’s its fulfillment in the form of Christ.

    The purpose of the Law (not its rabbinic extensions) was to lay out exactly what it took a person to live and act in a matter deemed righteous by God so that He would be glorified; and to prove to them that, by themselves, apart from Him, they were incapable of doing that. The Tanakh documents this in fine detail, documenting the LORD’s repeated appeals to Israel to put their faith in and obedience to Him, and their repeated refusals, other than a tiny remnant, to do so.

    This is why, despite countless extensions of mercy by the LORD, He ultimately ended the covenant with Israel that they themselves had consistently abrogated, judged them finally, and inaugurated the New Covenant that Jeremiah (Jer 31:31) had prophesied 500 years previously.

    The differences between Judaism and authentic (not institutional) Christianity are far more profound than some contrasting beliefs in a few secondary doctrines (Hell, Satan, etc.). They’re also more significant than whether a God-Man can atone for another man’s sin (instead of a lamb or goat).

    In the end, it’s the difference between ritual religion and faith, between an external God and One who makes His home (tabernacle) within, and between a people looking to God only for protection and provision and a people looking to serve God in thanksgiving for His faithfulness. The two peoples and their belief systems, like their two Covenants, could scarcely be more different.

    The thing that’s quite unbelievable about all of this is how it could have been that the Rabbis and Priests continued to miss the message the LORD was delivering to them through His prophets. How could they dismiss Jeremiah 31? How could they dismiss Isaiah 52-53 (the final servant song)? Or Isaiah 65? Or Ezekiel 34? Judaism wasn’t based on a fraud. It was based on the LORD’s instruction. But it was summarily dismissed and ignored. That is the true tragedy. And I, for one, have the deepest sympathy for faithful Jews today. They’re so close, yet have been led so very far away.

  28. Partner, Jews know how to read and especially how to read Hebrew! You don’t seem to get it. The Christian religion not only violates Jewish principles, and ethics it is the Anti-Judaic religion, that is entirely hostile and offensive to Judeism!
    If you want to keep running your baseless mouth off about your nonsense then don’t do it here!

  29. Hi Brain Warfare.
    First, thanks so much for stopping by my post on Bashing the Bible @Omnis Criticus and giving it a like. ❤

    I too am a little confused by your assertion that Christians have persecuted Jews. Especially considering that the entire history of the Jews, starting in at least the old testament (of which the first 5 books are what constitutes the Torah –did I get that right??) is mostly a history of Jewish persecution and warfare.

    I do understand that Christians started with Judaism then turned it into something not very related. But, I think the US, perceiving itself as a Christian country, actually goes out of its way to support Judaism as evidenced by the US playing a major role in the creation of the state of Israel and its continued support of that nation despite its many atrocities.

    That said, you are absolutely correct–to the degree that I know– that in the areas you mentioned the two faiths diverge. IN fact, whenever I listen to the lectures and defenses of Rabbis, I find them more reasoned and reasonable than almost anything that I've ever heard from Christian preachers.

    If your goal is to convince us that the Jews have been persecuted at the hands of the Christians for the last 2,000 years, it would help your position greatly to include a few salient examples. Thanks again for being out here with your ideas!

  30. How about Christian countries of Poland, France and Germany? All of them are highly antisemitic? What do you think has been going on for 2000 years?

  31. I can’t speak for those countries. And based on the title of your blog post, I was counting on you to tell me what has been going on for 2000 years. …offer some examples, enlighten the unknowing. Don’t just be angry, my friend. Be specific.

  32. I’m not angry, you asked and I replied. Go to jewsforjudaism.ca and figure it out for yourself.

  33. Yes you are right Jews have been persecuted and I feel sorry for that. At a personal level I have respect for Jews though I am a Christian. Anand Bose from Kerala.

  34. The Christian persecution of the Jews is the result of the ultra imaginary beliefs of Christianity;Demons, Hell, the Eucerist, Eternal damnation it turns out are fanciful Christian inventions that cannot be found in the Tanakh. As it turns out Christians belong in a mental institution, completely detached from Judaic principles,reality and are dangerous. Just ask the Jews what Christianity has done for them;Nazi Germany was a Christian nation.
    Imagine Mike Pence taking over for Trump making foreign policy decisions through a mind saturated in Apocalyptic Christian delusions…it’s a recipe for disaster.

  35. No and furthermore they do not accept that Jesus or anyone else can pay for another’s sin. Sin is a personal problem that only the sinner can manage by dealing with it himself.
    They also do not believe in original sin, so Christ did not die for original sin or the sins of man.
    So of course this is heresy to Christians and Jews have been the obvious scapegoat.
    As one Rabbi says, if Christians wanted to start a new religion they shouldn’t have glued their texts to the back of the Jewish Torah as an ad on because it doesn’t work anymore than when the Mormons glued their book on the back of the Christian bible!

  36. Satan was mentioned in the Torah in Genesis. He was the serpent who tricked Eve. And there is an afterlife – people have died and come back to life and told stories of how they either went to see Yah or Yahushua (God and Jesus) in Paradise or they went to Hell with the demons and then Yahushua/Jesus came. Or they saw both Heaven and Hell.

  37. It’s clear by looking beyond the superficial that Christianity is not what some people think it is.

  38. Heaven and hell are here on earth! Because it is other people who make it so 🙂
    Jew or not, I don’t care. All religion is the same to me. Belief or absence of any belief are all the same to me.
    It’s the direction, the intention and the driving purpose that exists behind the black of one’s eyes. There sits all the knowledge of the truth of existence.

  39. The serpent was a serpent. It was Christians that invented Satan and claim that the serpent was Satan. This is just another intentional falsification of the Hebrew texts by Christians.

  40. It would be wise not to create controversies about religion, faith etc. Every religion has its own importance for their believers. In fact, all the religions, faith are made for the improvement of mankind so that the precious life runs peacefully with the highest feeling to help each other.

  41. I’m not a Christian or a Jew, but I have read the Bible. I look for inspiration where I can find it, and find a lot of it in the Gospels and a little bit at least in the Old Testament.

    This is what I take from The Bible, from my pantheistic, non-supernatural interpretation.

    Some far distant ancestors of ours lived peaceful lives in harmony with the natural ecosystem which supported them. At some point their intellects arrived at the concept of idealism or morality, i.e. the idea that it is meaningful to distinguish some forms of behaviour which we we would call “good” – behaviour which promotes the integrity of the group – from some forms of behaviour which we would call “bad” or even “evil” – behaviour which compromises the integrity of the group. And, further, that it is meaningful to seek to encourage the former and discourage the latter through the exercise of self-discipline and group discipline. In this way we acquired a “conscience” – a mental orientation in which awareness that we had behaved “badly” led to a decrease in our level of self-acceptance. In other words we became prone to guilt. Since no-one’s behaviour can ever be ideal – that which is ideal existing only in the imagination – there would have been a gradual erosion of our self-acceptance. And since selfishness is the natural self-directedness of the suffering or insecure organism, this increasing tendency to have guilt feelings led to us becoming less capable of generosity. This would be a negative feedback loop in which the more we felt guilty about our selfishness the more selfish we became. The term “sin” means “to miss the mark”. We missed the mark of ideal behaviour and so we acquired a sense of being “sinners”. I think this is the meaning of “original sin” (in Christianity) and the meaning behind the myth of Adam and Eve being cursed as a result of eating from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.

    What would become a species-wide psychological condition left us prone to paranoia. Normally, if a volcano erupted and destroyed our village, we would have thought it was just what volcanos must do and we would have built our village somewhere else next time. But because we were guilt-ridden we interpreted natural phenomena which caused us strife as evidence that we were being punished. So first we had nature gods we had to appease. Later we came up with monotheism, the idea that there is one all-pervasive God that wants to punish us. As with the nature gods, he was both our benefactor – giving us life and the bounty of nature – but also our accuser and, potentially, our condemner.

    This disturbed state of mind gave rise to more and more complex forms of magical thinking, which we see in the supernatural side of religion. My own limited experience with magical thinking was during psychotic episodes. (I’ve never been a believer in things like virgin birth, literal resurrection from the dead, God sending plagues of frogs, etc., etc.) What I learned from my psychotic episodes is that irrational “magical” ideas, while literally delusional, are often symbolically meaningful. For example, running around naked in a hospital emergency room won’t make anything wonderful happen, but nakedness is a symbol for honesty, and honesty is road out of psychological alienation. So, while recognising that there are plenty of people who take the Bible stories literally, what I look for is a symbolic meaning which might give me insight into the humanity which has given rise to these stories, and thus, perhaps, insight into myself.

    For me personally, the key to the Old Testament is to replace the word “God” with the word “integrity”. If we serve our own integrity and that of our society then we may be blessed, but if we “have other Gods before us” then we and our society will fall into ruin. Unfortunately, maintaining social integrity, for the Israelites, sometimes meant pandering to prevalent social prejudices and torturing people to death. The book of Leviticus, in particular, gets pretty ugly. And they, at one time, portray their God as insisting that they undertake the mass slaughter of infants. Not to mention all that wasteful killing and burning of livestock just to make a pleasant smell in their imaginary God’s nose.

    My take on Jesus is that he was a remarkably mentally healthy individual who travelled around preaching a message of social and spiritual healing through love, non-judgement, the mutual forgiveness of sins, generosity to the poor, distrust of religious authorities, etc. I doubt that he actually believed in the supernatural. I think he just had a poetic way of expressing himself. For instance, when he said that people who believed in him would “never die”, I think what he meant was that people who came to believe in the attitude of life he was trying to communicate would not die inside themselves – i.e. become emotionally atrophied, as is the norm with our species.

    I think Jesus would have been horrified to know that he would end up as the central figure of a religion. I think what he wanted to do was to liberate the people of his land from religion. The Kingdom of Heaven, in his mind, I think was simply a healthy world in which we all lived simply and honestly and loved each other like the dearest of friends. And he wanted to show people the way there. He didn’t want some hierarchal institution of social control. He didn’t want just more hypocrites like the Pharisees lording it over the people.

    As soon as we envision Jesus as a human being, incapable of doing magic tricks, though able to have a “miraculous” healing impact on the emotionally troubled, who only had a small following and was crucified as just one of the multitude of men the Christians execute in this way, it becomes clear why the wasn’t mentioned by Roman historians. Some of the most important events are invisible, especially to those obsessed with the self-important. Did the art historians of Van Gogh’s time mention him?

    But Jesus legacy got hijacked by people like Saul of Tarsis. I don’t think it was intentional. Saul was just a troubled man who needed to believe that Jesus had died for his sins and that he would have a personal life after death. Jesus didn’t die for anyone’s sins. He died because his honesty was a threat to the authorities, whose power lay in dishonesty. And because people who are dried up inside can’t help but have a murderous resentment for those who are still full of life and love.

    In the Gospels, “God” is just another word for nature (he shines his sun on the good and the evil and clothes the lilies of the field) and love (where two or more are gathered in my name I am there with them.) If Jesus used the term “me” sometimes when talking of God, it was because he felt he was giving expression to “God” (i.e. love). As William Blake said : “God is the poetic genius.”

    While a thick vein of anti-semitism has run through Christian churches – and much of the persecution of Jews has been undertaken by people who identify was “Christians” – I think it is over-simplistic to see this as being a universal tendency arising from differences of teaching. People can believe different things without hating each other. As belief systems, of course they are incompatible, which is why the sensible approach is to let the Christians believe their nonsense and let the Jews believe their nonsense. They both look positively sensible compared to what the Muslims believe.

  42. The Christian religion presents sin as an abstraction. Original sin is viewed as inherited. They view sin vicariously where another person(mostly Jesus) can remove the sin of others. This idea at its most corrupt was demonstrated by the sale of Indulgences by the church to pay for the Basilica of St Peter. For a substantial price people could buy their way out of purgatory and hell in exchange for cash. Indulgences were retracted after the Reformation and have only recently been reintroduced by John Paul II.
    To Jews sin is not an abstraction, instead it is a personal circumstance in your relationship to a personal God. Sin is a violation of the laws by an individual and requires the individual to repent and go through a transformative personal process in order to deal with it. And so, original sin, and sin not being inheritable is a major not a minor distinction. The specific, definable Judaic idea of sin is spelled out in their texts while Christians remove personal responsibility by claiming that faith in Jesus is all that’s required because of the crucifiction.
    Christians believe in a pagan type of belief not unlike the Aztecs who sacrificed the beating hearts of their victims every day so that the sun might rise again. And again celebrate with a pagan ritual of vicarious canibalism, with the Eucharist.
    There are many incredibly opposing beliefs held by both religions and because the Jews came first, it is impossible that Christianity is not a contrivance, and fake.
    It’s not important how you interpret the scriptures but how Christians and Jews interpret them. If you want invite into the religions you need to look beyond your own approach.

  43. Robert,

    Thank you for your thoughts on the matter. I was wondering what sources show that Judaism does not believe in an afterlife? As two different Jewish sources I looked into both mentioned Hell in some sense, either conditional or eternal. Especially given that there are varying types of Jews (conservative and non-conservative for example) that is quite a broad stroke to say all Jews don’t believe in hell. Look forward to hearing from you.

    Brett

  44. Speaking as a Jew here. From the Psalms: If I go up to heaven, you are there, if I make my bed in the lowest parts if the earth, you are there (God).
    You will redeem my soul from the grave and I will walk in the light of the living.
    The Psalms constantly talk about being redeemed from the pit and walking in light with God. I highly respect Jews for Judaism. They were created to counter missionaries trying to convert Jews to Christianity, but it’s just not true that the Tanakh doesn’t speak about an afterlife or heaven or a form of hell, just not in the same way as Christianity. Kabbalism speaks about evil spirits and demons, the evil eye and it’s widely accepted and incorporated into jewish practices. It’s true the Sadducees didn’t believe in these things but the Pharisees did, which evolved into Rabbinic Judaism. Jews for Judaism is an expert for calling out the corruption of Christianity but they are not immune to their own corruption, hence my blog http://purejudaism.home.blog. As for anti-Semitism, Rabbinic Judaism’s corruption of Torah is I believe the root of the problem in so many ways. Yes the church has incentive to continue to demonize jews, but so does Islam. Only when Christians and Muslims fall away will anti-Semitism end. And they will once Rabbinic Judaism fixes it’s own corruption. I am highly intrigued with your posts, keep it up.

  45. There are inherent problems with Judaism itself as there are with all three of the revealed Abrahamic faiths. Thomas Paine summed it up best by declaring that a revelation is a personal demonstration that I am not logically required to believe because I was not the object of it. This reduces the texts to here say and subjects it to scrutiny. All of these Faith’s reject scrutiny at the point of death and punishment. The Christians and Islam are particularly dependent upon the threat of an eternity in hell as the result of denial, or critical thought. In fact Islam holds that Mohammad and the Quran are perfect and so criticism is absolute blasphemy. The Christians are no longer legally permitted to execute and torture in the name of their religion in Western Democracies so now solely depend on imaginary threats held over the heads of believers and non believers, that the teaching and practice has become one of total fear and self loathing.
    The Jews are much less engaged in fictitious concepts and afford much greater intellectual freedom; so you have Deistic beliefs, Atheists, Humanists, and Rabbis openly discussing the possibility of reincarnation.
    What is disturbing about all of them is their mutual exclusion of each other. Christians demonize Jews and justify their abuses because they judge them as subhumans because they reject Christ. And because of their alignment with evil because of this they are damned and troublesome and can be abused in good conscience by those of the correct faith.
    As in any utopian ideology the result desired(their version of a one world religion established by them) is the willingness to kill those people who stand in the way of their utopia. This has never amounted to any more than the desire to genocide, in the calculation of reaching their desired end.
    If any faith does take over the world by such means one day, it’ll be interesting that instead of reaching the utopia they justified their behavior by, they will have instead constructed another hell on earth.

  46. Robert, there’s not enough coffee in the house to spar with you! I’ll just say that the Torah makes it clear that God truly loves the Jewish people. That alone is reason enough for me to share that love. Thanks for reading!

  47. Jewish prophets talk of a utopia brought about not by force but by people being witness to the manifest awesome power of the God of Israel to protect his chosen people and defeat their enemies and so will willingly follow and obey his laws. However, the Talmud teaches it’s ok to treat non-Jews unfairly because they believe non-Jews are inherently impure, hence anti-Semitism. You are not required to believe anything because we have free will. You can test any revelation by observing if it proves to work out over time or explains consistantly how the world works by history. The proof God not only exists but also is intimately involved in mankind is the mere existance of the Jewish people.

  48. I’m not really that interested in Judaism any more than another theism, except as the reason for anti Judaism.
    What is easy to understand is that Judaic theology could not support Christianity and so we have 2000 years if persecution to hide this fact that destroys Christian credibility. So by demonize groups Jews the Christians have also excluded the credibility of the Hebrew texts and replaced them with falsified versions of them and circular arguments in their favor. When you look below the surface, and reject the authorities claims to investigate for yourself, it’s not well hidden at all…and so the fantastic Christian insecurity resulting in the violence.

  49. ok I get it. But things have changed. More and more Christians are moving away from that thinking and are coming closer to Judaism such as Messianic Jews and Hebrew Roots. Christians are not the ones persecuting Jews now. If you want to learn why there is still anti-semitism follow my blog. Peace.

  50. Christians are preaching the support for Israel as the means to accelerate the Apocalypse where Jews will be slaughtered on mass for not converting, but fourteen hundred will be saved. Yup, they have a lot of love for you! Take care, and don’t trust a Christians Trojan horse!

  51. It’s also interesting to compare that the Apocalypse fantasy would double the number of Jews slaughtered in the halocaust. About thirteen million Jews alive today? Sounds like a doubling down to me.

  52. As a Christian, I have love for all Religions of peace and do not make a habit of attacking others deeply held belief systems. I still defend their right to do so, due to my belief in freedom of speech.
    Everything that happened to Jesus was God’s will, it was not the fault of any person or religion. JMHO

  53. Ahhh! Theological discussions… always inconclusive, as each one tends to cling to their beliefs. I was born into the South Indian Syrian Orthodox Christian faith, but left the church because some priests’ interpretations of God’s will were not to my liking. See my blog post “Ice From Heaven” on aviott.org to read my view. I won’t repeat it here.

  54. Ironies: (1) Jesus never denounced Judaism. (2) His purpose was to highlight historic hypocrisies of his time (within “His” Jewish faith. (3) “Hypocricy” is not exclusive only to religion, so ALL people may benefit by avoiding it particularly if any religion speak out against it (in any way…inclusive of ANY human behavior subject to the devastating effect of hypocrisy. (4) Christian Bible acknowledges the Jewish people are the apple of G-d’s eye..because I suspect they, in principle and intention, left fractured religious thinking and began to see creation (creator) holistically…more broadly and more exaltedly and found formal ways to better understand and practice bigger thinking about themselves (Human) in relation to a GREAER (a greater degree of spiritual integrity (5) As many Christian as there are “Only a remnant” will be saved; and the overt haters of them (hater of ANYONE…Jewish, other Christian…any other religion…Those sorts of Christians WON’T LIKELY BE AMONG THOSE REMNANT…AND THERE ARE SO MANY CHRISTIAN OF TREMENDOUS OPPOSITION, LACK OF FAITH…AND WITHOUT AN OUNCE OF PEACE TO OFFER. (6) Jesus was Jewish and for Judaism…and may not really be considered any less than any other Jewish denomination of which there are many.

    Never mind what any christian says who came after Christ. They weren’t Jesus…and are subject to any human reasoning as is any Jewish person of their own faith.

    Jesus DID despise hypocrisy though.

  55. Jesus wasn’t a Christian. Christianity was a religion discussed and decided on by vote at the First Council of Nicaea. Christianity is never mentioned in the Jewish Tenak or the Christian Bible.
    The general Christian theology was the self invention of Paul of Tarsus who wrote 13 books of the NT and he was insanely anti Judaic.
    You should read the Creed of Constantine to get a grip on the anti Judaic diatribes of the christian(pagan Roman) church

  56. Yes, Robert! And so we see…how diluted and perverse the original message got as it was subject to human reasoning and how immediate the effect compounded over time…which is exactly what happened to Jewish Religion back…2000 years ago…to which Jesus principally spoke about… MOSTLY to his own people. There were NO CHRISTIANS back then, he never left his own lands or strayed from his own people…ever!

    It is amazing what “Gentiles” did with the information AFTER Jesus was…oh…how to say this PC…”Martyred” despite the fact I doubt very much he REALLY wanted to be crucified…but that was how Romans (and by attrition, Jewish people allowed their own) delt with dissidence back in the day.

    And nothing changed. Gentiles created “Christianity”…by hook or crook, they found a cause to “Fight” with and for to justify hate…and murder…and killing…pillaging, destroying…and justify these over a belief inspired by a man that was peaceful. IRONIC! PERVERSE!

    And Jesus was still Jewish; called by many of his people in that time…Rabbi. He won the hearts of many people back in the day; for his compassion…courage…willingness to try to exemplify more than the hypocrisy of his day AND only in opposition to hypocrisy.

    In spirit, anyone that turns to religion is ultimately seeking the same thing…but…”Religion” turns ugly.

    Ecclesiastes 1…the whole chapter strongly describes the process by which an exalted intention in spirit ultimately causes great suffering when left to those that seek wisdom through reason.

    To doing so only perpetuates the opposite of what God loved his people most for; un-fractured devotion to THE Creator; finding reverence in something bigger than reason…wisdom; For the Creator is yet ineffable…And no one is content despite What Jesus tried to exemplify…and many people still do…in all faiths descended from Judaism….

    That’s all.

    I hear what you’re saying. It’s true. What’s the solution?

    Nothing new under the sun…yet.

  57. I like the concept of monotheism and this may be consistent with the quest in physics for the Grand Unification Theory; One theory that describes everything.
    Deism is an alternative that makes sense.
    In any event religion has to be consistent with facts and the Christian image of Jesus depends on magical thinking and the supernatural.
    In Judaic theology spirituality spirituality is not non physical but the elevation of the physical
    And because of this non delusional thinking Jews are awarded 90% of the Nobel prizes in math and physics. No magic required! 🎯

  58. Kudos to math and science left unguarded by conscience. There is nothing magical about meaning; what a thing means particularly if it supports UNITY…at the very least acceptance of any particular human state or perspective that fosters SURVIVAL of…oh say…Human beings as a species.

    Those very instruments of reason, higher thinking and “Discovery” by/through math and science…lead to a significant destruction of habituate, radioactive contamination of quite a bit of Earths land and water masses, experimenting further finds tremendous discovery but without holistic consideration to what it “means” to live in a filthy world as exemplified by new diseases, suffering and no new cures except to palliate because death seems imminent by self destruction. 90% of non-delusional thinking Jews then contribute an equal proportion to what ails humanity then…because there is no conscience in racial pride; but there evils to which Jewish people have no exclusive right…but humans do, nor do they have exclusivity to all human virtue…much of which has been gained through a compounded accumulative collective experience as a species; all have contributed in math, science and belief about…what life means.

    And so…Jesus opens the playing field to ALSO remember the enifable is still alive in conscience…and in better consideration of our small place in a very big universe within which are many evils. NO ONE is excused, and pride cometh before the fall…across the entire playing field…math, science…religion…New Age Woo woo, Magic…INTENTION.

    Is it from the Race of Jewish in consternation of the Christian “Religion” you speak, or is it from your Jewish Faith you praise the accomplishment of Jewish people outside of Religion and only accomplishment by race?

    I’m curious.

  59. The Christian interpretation of spontaneous creation when combined with their Doctrine of Depravity, and the eternal afterlife is the cause of the majority of the depravity in this society.
    Knowledge isn’t harmful, and in fact it’s necessary for survival. It’s the denial of knowledge that is the major crime of Christianity from the slave bible in America to the pre Gutenberg press where it was regulated and controlled by the few in order to pacify the exploited peoples. It’s harder to fool knowledgable people. People are as deprived of it today as ever and it’s intentional.
    Hosea 4:6
    My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge; because you have rejected knowledge, I reject you from being a priest to me. And since you have forgotten the law of your God, I also will forget your children.

  60. I’m just talking facts and they are independent of my beliefs. I would however consider Judaism as a personal religion but I have a problem even with it because it is a revealed religion. This means that I have to take the word of someone else that someone saw a miracle or talked to G-d….so right away this is something I have to reject.
    But in general Jewish monotheism has the least amount of irrational silliness than the others and the greatest degree of internal coherence; One language, One book, and One G-d. Christianity by contrast has over 50 different versions of the bible translated into over 2000 languages and the RCC prays to hundreds of saints, Angels, mothers and a trinity. Jews only pray to one G-d, anything else is idolotry.
    The Christian gods have done little to protect the integrity of their texts and maybe this is not unintended?

  61. In-DEED! I actually do see you point. OK.

    And, too what Hosea 4:6 exemplifies is that his people disappointed him. By “His” people I mean…a people of his creation…as we all are and in however you imply that to mean…concretely or as a reference to a nebulous ineffable god (or reverently G-D) .

    Take comfort, My friend…Christ spoke of false prophets…and any faithful Christian is not excused from being mislead. As you pointed out RIGHTFULLY, There is a lot of corruption within Christianity as a Religion.

    It’s like…Christianity is the bastard step child of Judaism, Yet…there was one single human being above all others of your faith AND race that seemed to inspire…something wonderful, and it was corrupted…by human beings, yet there is a solid core of principles that are…exalted in principle…and it began with Judaism.

    Hosea speaks clearly of what disappoints G-d; Not new…happens all the time.

    Jesus did speak of an “Eternal Life,” but…you know? He didn’t exactly say what that meant…and the Bible…AS TRANSLATED through a few different languages; G-d Only knows what he really meant by that.

    But besides all the hocus pocus, Robert…there are valuable core principles that Jesus taught. Was he “The Christ?” Was he the “Messiah?”

    I don’t really claim to know from any other perspective then my own Christian belief, and my own ideas…they are my own…not meant to be displayed as dogma (because at this level it really is quite personal). But to the core principles of Jesus himself as presented in…our only record “the Bible” (of my generation)…yeah…those were pretty stellar core principles to lead a G-d Centered/considering life? for those not versed in math or science, it’s enough to keep one cooperating in something as old as humanity; “cooperation”…unity; higher “Conscience” as it relates to anything human…including math and science.

    Thanks for the discussion. There is not one point you present that I would condemn as wrong, for why purposefully be ignorant? I am not.

    I agree to agree to all your truths and facts, and I agree to an ineffable G-d…about whom you yourself quoted from scripture.

    You are not ignorant either. And being careful of one another and all people seems universally a good idea…unless they really are just perverse to be evil…then let the devil take them if they will not do good works on purpose which is evil. G-d forgets those that lack knowledge just as the Ecclesiastes preacher bemoaned the woe that wisdom garners.

    We will, rather, be discerning of what is knowledge. There are many kinds that meat many different ends.

    We want the one’s that please G-d

  62. Christianity is indeed Evil;
    Thomas Aquinas concluded in his Summa Theologica that since access to heaven was an infinite gain that the evil committed to convert someone was justified and could not be excessive. The acceptance of this doctrine provided the church to justify mind boggling evil. And people that were determined to be impossible to convert like the Jews were going to Hell anyway and could be disposed of like human refuse to prevent them from spreading their heresies.

    The Christian concept of Redemption according to Paul of Tarsus who wrote 80% of the New Testament also specified that the abuser didn’t need to recognize his debt to the victim, and that by following Jesus the forgiveness of God was all that was essential. And so the Catholic Church has always focused on the criminal priests and not the victims of abuse who’s lives were ruined.

    These doctrines are not held up to scrutiny, are concealed and prove how evil Christians are in fact! 🎯

  63. Not “All” Christian…except by those who hate all Christians.

    I wonders…for those who would follow strictly what Jesus taught? Not those that came after…not the haters, but those that loved “Jesus” and the teachings and way he prescribed. “Jews for Jesus” is the ONLY thing that makes logical sense, but I think this group is also despised…by both Jew and Christians.

    I advocate for “Conscience.” There’s plenty of examples in the Christian Old Testament. As for Jesus himself (Historically)…out of context of the new testament beyond John (even that could be dubious by your standards)…was beautiful. There wasn’t anything out of context with the first 4 books of the new testament and the entire old testament: Miracles, judgment, G-d speaking through his servants; G-d revoking esteem from those that fell…redemption; human virtues to live by.

    All Jesus did was exemplify a response to evil; not in opposition to Doctrine of his faith, but hypocrisy of his doctrines as witnessed and suffered by his people.

    What people did with that afterward? There is no doubt, Robert. The consequences are here for all to see. We can’t deny it…nor should we. Evil…is evil, as Sin is Sin (missing the point and being perverse).

    It’s a really good conversation to keep going, but the hating…it’s not so great from either perspective. And Your reasoning isn’t hateful. In a way, it is exactly what Jesus did and for the exact same reasons.

    Let there be no hypocrisy between us. There is none as far as I’m concerned…which is difficult to explain because I consider myself “Christian”…but closer to…”Jews for Jesus” then I would be allowed in either religion. So…I got my own…Ideas….LOL.

    Peace

  64. I didn’t say all Christians were evil. I said Christianity is evil and I did not even scratch the surface to support this assertion!
    And Jesus never said he was G-d, in fact he said things that dissuaded this belief.
    A son of God and a son of man were terms used by not only the Hebrews but the pagans and the first occupancy is in the book of Genesis.
    It wasn’t until the first council of Nicaea that the Son of God was inverted to the title God the Son and the unholy trinity was invented.
    And Jesus although unorthodox was Torah compliant in the gospels. It wasn’t until Christianity was invented that Jesus became known as the Lawless One. The true Lawless Ones were Paul, Constantine and the Imperial Roman Cult.

  65. The deification of Jesus did not exist until Aurilius and his advocates lost the vote in Nicaea. Jesus was decided to become God the son by an election!
    The Imperial Roman Cult previous to this also deified emporer a by voting on it!
    Do you really think all this shit was delivered from outer space not involving people, religion and governments?

  66. I think I generalized an implication I have defense to when you said, “Christianity” is evil. Pardon me. In retrospect, you are accurate on that count.

    As to the other assertions, Robert…preliminarily I will take your word as a would be consideration because, “within” the “Christian religion” there is great suffering due to irreconcilable contradictions that ARE purposefully exploited by greedy evil people. NO DOUBT! It IS self evident…and OBVIOUS. IT IS MORE to do with “Religion” in general…Christianity being a very large perpetrator. YES! And Jesus spoke of this regarding another religion. No hypocrisy. There is none here.

    Is this not concretely “seen” as exemplified by overt observable consequence and plain ol’ outcome in witness by those within and without “The Church” of many churches known as Christianity? The schizophrenia of it…it IS madness…and in-sane.

    And many faithful spend a life time of suffering trying to reconcile that part of themselves that would be faithful to something greater than the “Religion” of Christianity To exemplify. It’s not really different than Islam…ironically…and shamefully…and on this point as expressed about the “religion” that hold the faithful hostage and in a bondage of how we would find Faith in the G-d we believe in…which is Beautiful; Faith in a [The] CREATOR that science and math have not yet figured out, but upon the way to trying has found our destruction in uncountable ways!

    Some must reconcile our faith. It’s not so easy to give up…what you were born into when it is intrinsically tied as a cord is wound through weaving many threads; bound up tightly within the bond that keep our body, mind and spirit working at the personal level which I think many Christian MUST turn to because the “Religion” of Christianity IS unforgiving…and ruthless.

    Jesus wasn’t though.

    And I already figured that out about the apostles. Whenever some hateful Christian hate group needs to justify something…they skip over the first four books of the New Testament and find sanctification for hate and fear mongering between the books of Acts and Revelations.

    Most “faith” loving Christians really only want a G-d centered life. I wonder what will become of us…?

    Ironically…”Faith” in its deeper practice is an answer. Yes, that is…not math or science centered, but it is a for real word that references something concrete in our human condition. Until the unknown is known, she seek…and Faith Keeps is moving through what the condition of being human also offers: evil and perversity…terrible fear…but a need to know despite these.

    Ironically, Scientists engage faith…or tenacity. LOL. Call it what you will. Both may be true.

  67. No…and yes. I live in the same world you do, Robert. I’m so ethereal to not see what is right before me. AND…there is more than that…about which…? (Shrug).

  68. You are right about monotheism. I’d drawn the same conclusion…taking it a step further and as I already stated U.N. this conversation. That is to say again, I believe that the Jewish “People” are considered G-D’s chosen people because they Unified (literally and figuratively) their concept HOLISTICALLY while all the barbarians were still sacrificing themselves, were fractured in their ability to perceive greater within the continuum of creation…reverence was more purely engaged.

    That’s what I concluded. Christianity believes in the same G-d of Abraham…but….well the religion became…too ridged and constrained…and in-humane. Like I said…Schizophrenic….Multiple Personality disorder.

    If Jesus had not been Crucified by the Romans…

    And if man had more conscience on his own without need for religion to regulate himself…

    (Sigh)

  69. Christianity was an invention used by Imperial Rome to once and for all suppress Judaism which was incompatible with the empire.
    It was also a change in business model choosing instead to focus on religion as a business instead of the military.
    And Christianity was as ruthless as the Imperial Empire. Rome has 35 words for killing and their church was just as expressive at killing.
    Rome was a Slaver State and as constructed Christianity set the conditions of manipulation for 1000 years of the Dark Ages and Feudalism(slavery)) in Europe. It also coincided with the deterioration of the military empire.
    They won’t explain this in Sudan school! 🎯

  70. Many Jewish messiahs were crucified by Rome…thousands!
    Four philipinos were crucified from noon TIL 3 pm on the last Good Friday.
    All walked away after and two went out for dinner and dancing with their wives afterwards. Three hours is not enough time to kill a man. In fact by description I would prefer crucifiction to eternal Hell. So it’s a lot of hubbub about nothing!

  71. I never said that. LOL. I NEVER EVEN implied that. LOL.

    I once read that religion is simply the politics about G-d. And I’m laughing because I see that it is true.

    And then there is still plenty not known considering EVERY thing spoken here is about what is passed down from historical account which are always subject to the writer’s interpretation; filtered by the reader’s world view as gained by his life lived. Fact is fact. History is history…and as to the importance of the fact of it…How may we be allowed to be made better by its knowing? Are we allowed that?

    What does redemption mean?

    You are sovereign.

    It is good to be in the here and the now where we make of history what we will. You eluded to this early on. And it’s good to be in good conscious, due diligence to prevent past mistakes by doing our best not to repeat history. And we work with what we have.

    Christianity religion lost integrity a long time ago, yet…upon the backs of many faithful…certain core principles prevail.

    Any principle is subject to corruption.

    So it is important to be discerning. Knowledges helps, yes. Wisdom…needs discernment.

    I guess I advocate for those of Christian Faith with higher intentions and strong will to discern diamonds from stones despite where either came from.

    It is the best I can concede to, because Christianity, as evil its history and origin is a human contrivance as is every religion.

    And still there is still in man a soul. Never mind its definition…only that with knowledge only, man is killing itself and has been…since the beginning. Until we can move beyond what many call “Myth” and reason and knowledge have a truly responsible steward, religion (Christianity…any religion) is here to stay so long as it provides enough unity to avert mass destruction.

    Right now, it’s the greenies trying, but they lying too! Shoot!

    LOL

  72. Dont be offended, but AMEN to that! LOL. TO FURTHER…self flagellation…lord, help ‘em! But…some pilgrimages…bloody knees, palms…fasting, sitting in ashes…Job very much comes to mind.

  73. And Abraham to Issac…and God’s testing of obedience. What wouldn’t man do for what they believe of God?

    And Jesus? Rather “Crucifixion than an eternal Hell.” So ironic that the symbolic meaning of Jesus life was overshadowed by the Sin of exploiting Jesus Death…and terrorizing mere mortals into compliance…which was not Jesus exemplified life as lived.

    Point taken.

  74. It’s not a coincidence that all of the julioclaudian emporer also held the title of Bishop of Rome, Pontifex Maximus who was the head of the Roman Imperial Church. Caligula, Julius Nero and Constantine held the title Pontifex Maximus, the same title passed down to all Catholic Popes including Francis.
    The gospels are all written in Greek, not Hebrew. Greek was the academic language of Pegan Rome and the apostles wouldn’t have been able to read or write if they were simple fishermen and farmers, and they surely wouldn’t have used Greek, but Aramaic or Hebrew.
    The official language of the church remains Latin, the Roman tongue. The sabbath is no longer observed under Christianity and instead it was replaced by Sunday which is the Pagan Roman day of worship to their Sungod Mithras. To this day half the churches in Rome are full of Christian icons upstairs but have a shrine to Mithras in their basements.
    Judaic theology is incompatible with Jesus as a the Messiah or a mangod. If Christianity is claiming lineage from Judaism then it’s impossible that this happened.

  75. Rome adsorbed religions from conquests into their state religion. The attire of Catholic bishops, cardinals and Popes is almost identical to those of the pagan Roman religious leaders. The fish hat still worn by Catholic Popes is from the Phoenician cult of Dagon(the fish God) and even today the fish symbol is entangled with Christianity.
    When Christians worship they are being tricked into worshipping pagan Roman deities.

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